Please i need us to comment on the issue of a South African Nation Zimbabwe. Where are they heading to economically
Please i need us to comment on the issue of a South African Nation Zimbabwe. Where are they heading to economically
its a simple but vicious cycle:
in zimbabwe's case
first the country has a bad harvest, so there's not a lot of food to go round, so the little food available gets more expensive due to competition to buy the food.
secondly bad harvest leads to no foreign exchange leading to fewer goods being imported, the same scenario again lots of money chasing few products. have that cycle repeat itself in a number of areas with no control on the amount of money in circulation (in zimbabwe's case they simply printed more money), prices just keep going up because demand far outstrips supply.
thats a simplistic explanation but i think it has the basics
When asked if he would accept outer help from the Communists:
"Let me tell you a little story. It's like being in a wolf's den. The wolf sees someone on the outside who is interested in freeing me from the den. The wolf doesn't like that person on the outside. But I don't care who opens the door and lets me out."
hahaha! nice one dru
but i think you know what i mean, them chinese will do anything, they even take organs out of prisoners and sell them to people needing organ transplants without consent of the prisoners!
the europeans aren't saints, i never said they were. in my opinion comparing them is like 6 on one hand, half a dozen on the other
you call selling off state assets cheaply to the chinese because mugabe is desperate 'helping'??
if the europeans were bent on 'Molesting' zimbabwe as u put it, he's just trading one evil for another, a much worse one. the chinese will trade with the
devil himself if they will get what they want. and they'll rip you off while at it.
the zimbabweans are still starving by the way, the chinese just bought their copper mines cheap and will pollute the environment and suck them dry.
so much for help
you miss the point,
the sanctions are not economic, govt officials were simply restricted from travelling to britain,US and some other western countries
and of course, financial aid was stopped. the real problem arose because zimbabwe no longer had any foreign exchange (usually obtained via the tobacco and other agricultural exports) and could therefore no longer meet its balance of payement obligations. coupled with mismanagement and the drops in the prices of copper (which affected zambians as well). the economy was still doing good before the land grab destroyed agricultural production along side the allied industries. that is the real cause. the sanctions were more political than anything, simply the same thing that was done to abacha, suspension from the commonwealth. nigeria's economy did not flatten because of that, its mugabe's policies that have caused this. ther can be no buck passing on that.
PS he is still trading with the chinese and ha sold most of the country's copper mines to them cheaply. obviously the sanctions were not placed by the 'whole world' as you put it.
How can someone see that the whole world has put sanctions on Zimbabwe and say that the economy is ruined and that is purely his fault?
That is like saying:
I am going to rob your store but if you try to stop me the beating I give you will be purely your fault.
See little slave, if you had not tried to run away, I would not have had to give you this whipping, it is purely your fault.
Your honor, I was trying To Molest the girl but she fought back and I had to stab her, so the stabbing was purely her fault.
yes they were doing good, at least much better than they are doing now, with the 'white farmers' income and taxes, zimbabwe developed the highest literacy rate (over 90%) in africa. if they were crossing over to south africa before, they are even doing so more now!! over 1million people from southern zimbabwe have flown over the border into botswana and south africa because of the famine. yes they were sending their kids to college, at least the money they earned had value!! and let me correct you, zimbabwe was a net exporter of food meaning they had more than enough that they were serving as a food basket for the region, now they have become a food aid dependent nation. how can that possibly be an improvement??
even if the white farmers were doing it for profit, they were feeding the zimbabwean people, a lot better than the high level politicians, including mugabes wife who the farms have been given to now. they were not dependent on outsiders for food, the contry was self sufficient. mugabes greed and thirst for power has ruined that, has ruined the nation even.
On 1 November 1989, a former junior minister, Denis Walker, produced a paper in London for the Conservative Monday Club's Foreign Affairs Committee on Land Reform in Zimbabwe. In his last paragraph he stated, with clear insight, as events have proved, that "once the land has been redistributed, the commercial farms will be broken up, the remaining white farmers reduced by exile or imprisonment; Zimbabwe's government, already morally bankrupt, will decline towards economic collapse."
In a recent investigation in The Independent it was uncovered that many state-controlled mines have been sold cheaply to the Chinese, in a desperate scramble for foreign currency. It was noted that Mugabe's regime has forsaken much of the control of economic resources, which will prevent Zimbabwe from rebuilding the economy even if the MDC take charge.
the foolishness of mugabe's land grab was predicted years before. and it has come to pass.
he is even selling off assets to chinese cheaply. isn't this a different form of colonialism??
or it is only if they are 'western' that it is colonialism.
lets try to be objective. yes black zimbabweans have a right to land, but that is NOT the reson mugabe did it, he did it to satisfy his cronies and to hold on to power, and the country is paying dearly for it/
So before Mugabe did all of this.
The Blacks in Zimbabwe were doing good?
They all had good jobs and were using their middle class purchasing power to start their own business's and were sending their kids to college and building their own country for a better future for themselves?
Zimbabwe's blacks were poor.
And even if they had a job at a good company, they still had to grow food for themselves to keep from starving even with their good job.
They were crossing into South Africa to work in the mines, because there was nothing in Zimbabwe.
They were living really badly then!
People should stop trying to pretend that the white farmers, whose Tobacco crops were a third of the crops by themselves were doing all this wonderful feeding of the Zimbabwean people.
4 play, oh oh, so you want Mugabe to keep Zimbabwe depending on western food ? Is It how you secure the future of today's generations and the welfare of the generations to come? How many blacks own land in UK ? Some have been there for centuries but are still being killed in the streets by racist thugs. Remember the Liverpool crime where a young black was killed for being with a white girl.
Here is my point : This is africa, own by africans, we were independent less than 50 years ago,we don't have the same level of agricultural power as the USA , France, UK or Germany do today.Africa is starting with some weaknesses ,but steadly has control over its natural resources ,in the midst of racist europeans who always feel bad when they hear that some african countries are doing well. Libyan Children did nothing wrong when they were purposely injected HIV by european nurses. After they injected the virus to innocent children, they blame bad conditions in libyan hospitals. Did any of those who are accusing Mugabe of being a dictator come forward to blame these evil nurses? No, they are defending them and want to see them free.
It is also hard to understand this HIV burst in south africa after the apartheid regime collapsed.
Zimbabwe is lucky those we all know are only focused on Mugabe they could have done nasty things to the people of this country.
Before talking about the interests of white farmers Tony Blair who his well known as a falsifier, (he lied about Irak ) should pay repartation to zimbabwe for all the riches the british stole from this part of africa during the years of colonial occupation.
They now say Mugabe has 1.5 billions in some banks. Knowing how they twisted the facts about Patrice Lumumba why should we take them seriously ? Lumumba was portrayed as a cannibal.
God bless brother Mugabe and God bless King Lobengula the hero.
Note: 1) Lobengula was king of the Matabele.
2) Libyan children Hiv case : http://service.spiegel.de/cache/international/spiegel/0,1518,383903,00.html
Drusilla the british didn't renege on promises, mugabe and his cronies pocketed all the cash.
The drought in southern Africa, perhaps the worst in a century, affected Zimbabwe so severely that a national disaster was declared in 1992. The drought compounded the country's debt crisis. The ensuing IMF-backed economic adjustment and austerity program caused further widespread hardship. Continued intimidation of the Ndebele minority in the south has caused nearly a million of them to flee to South Africa.
With the implementation of majority rule, whites remained dominant in the nation's economy. They made up less than 1% of the population but held 70% of the country's commercially viable arable land, of which only a small parcel had been purchased and reallocated to blacks since independence in 1980, in spite of millions of pounds of aid from Britain given for this purpose. Most purchased farms ended up as the property of high-ranking military and political personnel. However whites held no political power. Land redistribution from whites reemerged as a political issue beginning in 1999.
The forced removal of the white farmers caused sharp rises in prices of agricultural commodities such as corn and sugar, and the collapse of Zimbabwe's economy. Zimbabwe was formerly an important net food exporter to the region, but in recent years starvation has been widespread because of Mugabe's land reform policy, which redistributed land to political supporters of Mugabe who do not farm the land efficiently. This has left the large majority of landless blacks worse off, due to a catastrophic fall in productivity, a spectacular rise in inflation (1000% in May 2006) and widespread unemployment.
keep denying o, i pray u never fall a victim of this
propaganda abi? go and talk to the 700,000 people he has rendered homeless because they were supporting the opposition. all of you arm chair supporters of mugabe don't know the gravity of the situation o the ground. so is it pro[aganda that they have 1,000% inflation, or that they need food aid (because if they didn't need it why would they be rejecting the gm grains from america?) . since its not affecting you you can easily keep on defending him. by the way akola i hope u supported obj's third term bid, because thats the same sham mugabe has been pulling for 20 years. refusal to learn from the past is planning for future doom. its gotten so bad south africa had to send soldiers to its border to stop zimbabweans from crossing over to avoid starvation. keep denying the famine.
yeah, after 2million people die of starvation, obviously you don't know how famine works. the areas are naturally suceptible to droughts, once you have on ethis year, unless you make adequate preparations ( which mugabe and co are incapable of doind) there will be famine next year, which will result in farmers eating the seeds tehey are supposed to plant, leaading to an even worse famine the next year. its a vicious cycle, that there was absolutely no need to get into.
zimbabwe is being proud, niger got food aid by the way, the govt just wanted to seem in control so they lied to the world that they didnt need it, till the UN went in and saw things for themselves. i'm sorry for the country, it is when it takes 1 billion zimbabwean dollars to buy a loaf of bread that they will come to their senses and just get out that senile geriatric called mugabe. imagine, 20 years after independence he's still talking about 'freeing zimbabwe from colonialists', instead of focusing on making the country better. most farm workers in the us/canada are from mexico, there's no reason why the white farmers can't continue to farm side by side with the balck ones till they learn.
of course you won't lose a drop of sleep, afterall it doesn't cost you $100,000 to buy bread and milk to last you for a week!!
In reality only 13 percent of the US economy has anything to do with exports/imports.
Zimbabwe has actually turned down food aid from America, they refuse to use our genetically mutated grains.
Ask yourself this:
Why are people starving in Niger and there is not enough food aid for the people in Niger?
Why were people starving in Ethiopia and it went unnoticed for a long time?
Yet, Zimbabwe a most hated enemy supposedly, is given food aid?
There is something going on behind the scenes.
Not quite sure what that is but I do not lose a drop of sleep thinking that I will wake up tommorrow and the people of Zimbabwe will be sitting in the middle of fields, starving to death on the land that Mugabe has given them.
Sooner or later somebody gonna get hungry and plant the field.
The British promised to pay the farmers off, if Zimbabwe gave them 10 years to do so.
Mugabe agreed to not take the farms by force.
The ten years was up. The British claim they did not pay because they were not sure who to pay and how to distribute it.
Mugabe took the farms.
Not only did the global community impose sanctions. The Whites within Zimbabwe were using the local markets to keep dollars out of the Zimbabwe economy.
Also they stay in Zimbabwe waiting for Mugabe to fall but will not lift a finger to help farm the land or train others to do so.
In otherwords white Zimbabweans want Black Zimbabweans to starve to death, their using their starvation as a political weapon against Zimbabwe.
He just played his trump card. By kicking out the little marketers and forcing them back to the farms.
Whites in Zimbabwe have no one to run to and use, they must play by his rules now.
To those who say that it is not right for whites to hold so much land in Zimbabwe,do they consider how much US financial assets are held by foreigners.Every country strives to get outsiders to invest in their country not chase them out in the name of nationalism.
Lets face it Zimbabwe is now more under the yoke of Western domination than ever before.Do you know that Zimbabwe receives food aid from the West to cope with famine.How can someone explain the irony in begging Western countries for aid because a policy was instituted to empower Zimbabwe by recovering land.Zimbabwe has turned from a net food exporter to receiver of food aid all in the name of economic independence.
I know this is a racism board but I think we should choose our words with care and blame everybody but ourselves for all our misfortune.
I actually didn't get the sense of it.
It wasnt the farms that crippled Zimbabwe's economy but the way Mugabe distributed the farms (making them unproductive) and also by the sanctions imposed on Zimbabwe by the "global community".
its so easy to fall into the trap of blaming western countries. is zimbabwe the only place where u have white farmers? you have them in zambia, namibia, and to a far greater extent south africa. just because he was looking for a way to secure his power base ( the war veterans), he just took a misguided and totally politically motivated move of seizing land and giving them to a bunch of yahoos who knew nothing about framing, if he set up a transfer policy where the black farmers could understudy the white ones, things might have been different. the guy has modified the constitution so many times just to suit himself, the only newspapers eft in zimbabwe are the ones supporting the govt. drusilla and co who say the dude is 'liberating' the blacks, just wait, its when aids and famine kill all the zimbabweans that your eyes will open. the guy should just go, after over 20 years, is he saying no one else can rule zimbabwe? his greatest opponent, morgan tsvangirai was jailed, accused of treason amongst other things, the country is simply kaput. let the people who know how to farm do so. in the 21st century mexicans are the ones farming most of the lands in the us. who cares whether the whites feel they are zimbabweans or not?? were people not being fed? were they not paying taxes? all this 'pan africanism/nationalism' is what has led them to where they are today. sit tight african leaders who continue to destroy the future generations because of their selfish hold on to power.
The Problem with Zimbabwe is a microcosm of the problem in Africa.
Zimbabwe is heading to financial ruin, with a 1000% rate of inflation, wide spread poverty, homelessness, famine, and disease, a loaf of bread and some eggs now cost Z$ 100,000.
1 US Dollar = 101,534 Zimbabwe Dollar
1 Zimbabwe Dollar (ZWD) = 0.00000985 US Dollar (USD)
Poor policies based more on sentiments and a leader's selfish ambition to cling on to power and misconstrued by naive Africans as panafricanism. Mugabe's land grab policy literarily forced "white" lands into the hands of his former war veterans, unfortunately these same "white" farms have remained the back bone of the economy that Mugabe is intent of destroying.
The whole problem is not Mugabe alone however. White Zimbabweans never consider themselves Zimbabweans, most of them consider themselves British citizens first and foremost and are only using illegally acquired lands to improve their own fortunes. After Mandela came into power in SA, thousands of white South Africans literarily left the country for England. As long as Mugabe left the white farmers alone, he was the darling of the "international community" despite his dictatorial tendencies.
Unfortunately, Africa remains the only continent that is still being dictated to by foreign interests. The same foreign interests who are the reason for her backwardness in the first place. Slapping sanctions against Zimbabwe is most unfortunate as the those who will feel the pinch the most are innocent Zimbabweans who are just unfortunate to be born in that country.
Zimbabwe recently withdrew from the commonwealth to the consternation of many South African neighbours. Mugabe may have done the right thing at the wrong time, he is right that some nations are more equal than others. The commonwealth has outlived it's usefullness, it started and has remained a master servant relationship between the England and her former colonies and an avenue for the British to exert undue control over the affairs of former African colonies. The commonwealth has served little or no purpose to it's African constituents and thus must be scrapped.
However, Mugabe must take some resposibility for his country's woes, for an 80yr old man who has been in power for 26 yrs and still insists on clinging on to power, it is a sad reminder of the sit-tight attitude of many an African ruler. In order to hold on to power, they end up running their nations into economic ruin. Obasanjo literarily tried to copy the Zimbabwean strongman and held the nation to ransom for over a year with dire consequences. Our economy hangs on world oil prices, social services are in dire straights and yet baba insists he is the best thing that ever happened to the nation.
Western nations may be the reason the likes of Zimbabwe is in a spot today but the intransigence of African leaders is also to blame for the ruin the continent is in today. Thanks to the vigilance of the Nigerian people, we would have been on the road to Zimbabwe long long ago.
The homeless were working with whites to make the economy of Zimbabwe worsen by having a place for whites to use and spend their dollars and not be forced to work within the Zimbabwe economy.
Mugabe is actually one of the few African leaders who did not slaughter the opposition.
But where is the outcry about those African leaders?
There is none, because whites are happy with those leaders. So you are happy with those leaders.
It is only the leader who disagrees with whites who will be hated, the leader who is a friend of whites can slaughter away as long as he keeps agreeing with whites.
the problem is mugabe, pure and simple. he wanted to remain in power, so he did waht the so called veterans of the independence conflict weanted- siezed white owned lands. and gave it to his cronies, even his wife. but u give peasants land, people with little or no farming skills beyond subsistence farming? of course things would fall apart. Mugabe has overstayed since 1980!! and some people think he's helping zimbabweans 'take control' of their economy. what economy?? its all gone, they can't even bottle ordinary coke again, its too expensive. he's just been using state power to crack down on the opposition movement for democratic change mdc. he deserves to be treated even worse than saddam. from food exporter to poverty induced famine and food aid receiver.
forget the so callled nationalism, its just mugabe doing stuff to suit himself and his cronies, what about the homes he demolished around harare? because they are inhabited by the main supporters of the oppozsition he rendered 700,000 people homeless!! he even refuses to distribute food to non-members of his party. the dude is a war criminal
Those who speak in defence of Mugabe have a missunderstanding of what is at stake in Zimbabwe.You have a President who wants to cling on to power by all means,using the land issue as an excuse.
The fact of the matter is that Zimbabwe depends on food aid from the West.How can u claim to be freeing Zimbabwe from Western colonialism and then institute policies that cause famine and a reliance on food aid from the West.It is only in Africa that people claim that starvation and economic collapse are the pathways to prosperity.
Let me reiterate that Mugabe has about 1.5billion dollars in financial assets.Anytime an issue is presented as a battle btw African nationalism and Western imperialism,Africans jump on the bandwagon and fail to see beyond our instinctive desire to attack the Western world.The sole responsibilty for Zimbabwe's problems lie in the hands of Robert Mugabe and nobody else.The sooner we stop blaming the West for all our problems the better.
Every African leader has always been faced with a dual problem when trying to take measures to reorient African economies to serve the people.
1. Western pressure not to change. This comes in the form of sanctions. Which have been put on Zimbabwe.
Saying that this is Mugabe's fault is akin to saying that the store owner who gets shot by a thief, is at fault for not offering the thief more money.
2. The people themselves, whine incessantly and not knowing freedom, they want to return to slavery, when times get hard!
White people use these traitors to pressure the African people into giving in to the first problem.
I can bet my mortgage that neither Panafrican or Drusilla live in Zimbabwe so they can afford to be blase about the economic conditions in Zimbabwe.The fact of the matter is that Mugabe himself has personal assets of about 1.5 billion dollars,so he can afford to pay for the land out of his personal pockets.And where did the money come from? From Zimbabwe's treasury of course.
Africans should be wary of falling for the nationalist propaganda that African leaders utilise to perpetuate their crimes
Zimbabwe is doing what It can to have control over its economy. This type of battle is not won overnight.
The crisis is normal because the country is going from a minority financial power to a broad based , socially viable country. The situation may be shaky for some period of time but will surely come to an equilibrium and then start soaring into a positive direction .Keeping the most fertile lands in the hands of CeciL Rhodes like farmers will do nothing except put the future generations in danger. Tony Blair and his cronies have to understand they don't have the divine right to control every wealth on earth. One needs to own something in his own country at least.
Remember the British negotiated this deal. They were supposed to have the white farmers paid off by now.
The British had a whole decade to pay the farmers.
It is painful now but in the long run it will work out.
Mugabe, is the only leader with balls as far as I can see. Here is hoping that he lives a good long time and rules forever.
While recovering land from White farmers was popular,the manner of the execution was unpopular and led to the present crisis in the country.A Govt has no biz relying on hired thugs to recover land.The land policy had nothing to do with the people of Zimbabwe,it was a smoke screen to retain power by exploiting an important issue
You seem to suggest that the economic problems of Zimbabwe have something to do with the disloyalty of the White farmers and the policies of Western Government. Nothing can be further from the truth.
Whether the White farmers felt loyalty towards Zimbabwe is irrelevant,the fact is that they contributed more than any other segment of ZIMBABWE to its economic wellbeing.It was Robert Mugabe's attempts to exploit their prescence for his political machinations that ruined the country.
The Western Govts that you attack have been the sole provider of most of the food aid needed to help Zimbabwe cope with the the food crisis.Without their help thousands of Zimbabweans will be dead by now.Don't forget that it was Western aid that underpinned most of Zimbabwe's earlier success,in the 80s Western aid provided almost a quarter of Zimbabwe's revenue.
There is no evidence that Western Govts have tried to stop Zimbabwe's Govt from selling its products.All they have done is desist from providing more economic aid to Zimbabwe which they are entitled to do after all its taxpayers money.If you thjink of the torrent of abuse that emanates from ZIMBABWE against the West,it is natural that the West might not want to continue spending taxpayers money to support such a regime.Even then taxpayers money is spent providing food aid to Zimbabwe.
The sole responsibility of Ziombabwe's economic malaise lies at the feet of Robert Mugabe whose Unclad ambition to stay in power has ruined a once great nation.The sooner Africans can see that, the better.We should not buy into the African nationalist propaganda that Mugabe spews in order to diguise his shenanigans as a case of anti Western imperrialism.
The issue of expropriating the white-owned lands was brought up for a constitutional review in February 2000,but was flatly rejected by majority of Zimbabweans. Shortly afterwards the white lands were forcefully seized by militia men and Mugabe's pre-independence war veterans. Nobody was left in doubt that this act was carried out with the support and active connivance of the government of Zimbabwe. The government had since come out with its land reform policies under which more than 5000 farms belonging to the white farmers had been siezed in what it says was meant "to correct the the colonial-era of imbalance in land ownership".
The exercise which is still ongoing is meant to appease the supporters of Mugabe. I recalled in August 2003 that I discussed this issue with my US History professor, himself a Zimbabwean, and he was in support of the action. There was no doubt that the action though politically motivated, was ill-conceived and was meant to galvanize support for an increasingly unpopular government.
A responsive government will have taken time to consider the implication of its actions before rushing to implement it. By displacing the farmers and distrupting the production of Agricultural products, the entire industry was turned upside down. By not considering the ramification of its actions and by letting political considerations overshadow the economic well being of the country, Mugabe as the head of the government of Zimbabwe remains accountable.
There is nothing misleading in blaming the land reform policies of the government as the root cause or if you might say, the genesis of the economic problem for the country. For more information read:
If you disagree, give your facts.
Seun, Zimbabwe's problem is a lot more complicated than you are making it appear. The white farmers you are talking about didn't really consider themselves Zimbabwean. They felt they were better than the average Zimbabwean and due to the stolen land that they had, they were also a lot richer. So, while it sucks that they lost all their land (The government should only have taken 40 percent or so) these people are far from angels.
Also note that the UK, United States, and many other countries are actively making it difficult for Zimbabwe to sell their products because they want to set an example of them for confiscating land from the white Zimbabweans.
To some how imply that the reason that Zimbabwe's economy tanked is as a direct result of giving the land to the natives is a bit misleading.
Who is undermining who? Whatever economic ruin that befall this country should be blamed on nobody except Mugabe. The runaway inflation in Zimbabwe has hit an unprecedented level comparable in recent history to the economic malaise that plaqued Argentina in the late 70's and 80's. The country had just issued a Z$100,000.00 bill which according to analysts on NPR (Radio) in Michigan USA , can only buy one loaf of bread, 4 pieces of egg and a pint of milk. In comparison Z$ 25,000 was sufficient to buy a house in 1980 when the country became indepedent.
The country is headed for total ruin unless Mugabe steps down and cause a reversal of his unpopular decision to forcefully acquire farmlands from the rich farmers for reallocation to the peasants. The rich farmers were previously the backbone or mainstay of the economy of his country and the sooner this is done the better for the country. Zimbabawe that used to be a net exporter of foods is now a net importer causing its balance of payment (BOP) to be in deficit because the foreign earnings from the sale of agricultural products had ceased.