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Are Catholics Really Christians?

This question cant really be overlooked, or can it? are catholics really christians? The problem is ...1. the catholics have too many doctrines/beliefs or should i call it that? Christianity is supposed to be simple. do this and u get this, do that and u get that, but overtime the catholics have brought in a hell lot of other things to contend with. Other issues that pertain to this divergence are petty, those involving mary being the mother or God and all that, the main issue is...why do they bow to graven images which is STRICTLY prohibited in the bible, even if it is the graven image of God himself? I WAS ONCE A CATHOLIC. when someone made me see reasons, i took off.

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193 answers

HYPOCRITES! JUST ONE POST AND THE THREAD IS CLOSED. PHARISEES OF OUR TIME.

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Sometimes when I take a close look at the Penticostal churches I wonder. Almost everything about them contravene the new testament that they cling to so much! They have very little regard for the old testament but would not hesitate to quote from it when it supports their selfish arguments, like when it supports tithing. Their pastors take huge millions in the form of tithe like the Livitical priests, even when it was written no where in the new testament where Christ or his apostles received tithes, and even paul made it clear that he requires no body's money as the works of his hands can provide for him. When Christ was sending his disciples out on evangelism, the order he gave to them was 'eat whatever is set before you.' and not demand one tenth of your converts' incomes.

Again, the main massage Pentecostalism tend to carry or atleast flaunts is prosperity. It was clear in the Bible that Jesus never said a Christian life must be that of affluence. Himself and the apostles made it clear that a Christian is not of this world, and that life on earth would be filled with tribulations and that they should be endured for our rewards are great in heaven. He however did not rule out wages by hard work. Alot of pastor even go up to the point of defrauding people so as to live an outward life of their perceived Christianity.

Again, they don't believe in doing good works, or, they don't see it as an essential part of our heavenly race they stick to Saint Paul's philosophy of justification by faith alone and even criticise those that labour in this direction. They over Christ analogy in the Gospel when he said that on the last day, the whole humanity would be divided into two groups, and to one he would say; When I was hungry you gave me to eat, when I was thirsty you gave me to drink, when I was unclothed you clothed me etc, now enter into the kingdom of my father and then the other half who never did anything like, he turned away, making it clear that good works is highly essential to get a man into heaven. Also, they ignore saint James epistle where he said faith without work is dead and clung to the one they saw easier.

Again, when they pray, they pray like the Pharisees, shouting out loud above their voices and very verbose, repeating the same phrases over and over again, ignoring the Biblical directive that Christians should keep their prayers simple and without vain repetitions and raising of voices but quietly, so that the Father who everything in secret would give his reward in secret.

It was at the advent of penticostalism that things like harlot-like dressing to Church, covering of hair, Voodoo in the Church for the sake of miracles, Pastors frying their hairs becoming a sign of reverence and alot of things that were not hitherto associated with the Church atleast became the order of the day.

There are a lot of things I observed I began to wander if they are actually Christians or a bunch if money making, public show, easy speaking, social organizations! Because based on the teachings of the new testament which they claim to uphold so much, they are not Christian! Based on the old testament which they denounce but embrace when it buttresses their arguments, they are not Christians! And based on the doctrines of the Apostles passed down, they are far from Christians! What are Pentecostals actually? I feel they are part of the devil's end time agenda, aimed at corrupting the very foundation of the Christian faith and her doctrines so that at the end, Christian would not even know what the standard is or supposed to be anymore. For example, most of them claim to have no teachings at all, calling it doctrines and making the word itself sound abhorrent. That is to say, no standard anymore, anything goes!

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catholic are guilty for war crimes,

in the 2nd world war, hitler receives blessing and support from catholics,

american catholics brothers and france catholic brothers killed each other,

this raised some question about 'where is Gods position'if God through pope approves shedding of ones blood under religious guise,

see pics below;

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Viaro, "what disqualifies Catholics from being Christians"? Go through [b][/b]Everything Jesus Christ and the Apostles said, and what they asked folks NOT to do (and the reasons why they told them NOT to do them, humans 'think' they're smarter than God in some way shape or form by rebelling, but we end up messing up and eventually 'killing' ourselves because our delusional mindsets get in the way of right thinking with God/Jesus), then you'll see what disqualifies Catholics, others and even some so-called christians as well? Open the Bible for yourself and see everything that God told us NOT to do, how we did those things anyway, and what's become of us all these 'centuries' later, then let me know how wrong God/Jesus has been thus far?? NOT gonna happen.

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bear in mind that the rituals performed in some of those religious movements were a rituals imitated from the catholic church. it only takes the newer generation of members to know that.

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I sympathise with that answer; but even so, it seems that almost every religious movement I've perused have one form of ritual or the other, no matter the arguments to the contrary. Aside from the 'rituals', what disqualifies Catholics from being Christians? I'm just wondering, though.

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^^^ Probably because of the heavy rituals which are just too fetish that it is difficult to differentiate between her and a traditional native doctor's shrine.

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Please, can I ask a question without being thought of as an agent provocateur?

Why do some people think that Catholics are not Christians?

PS. I've tried to read the thread and get the gist of the arguments for, against, and inbetween. They leave me still wondering about the question above.

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@ Babs87

That is what you call role play. Remember He placed aside His equality and divinity that He shared with His Father which He possessed before taking on humanity. Hence, the above-mentioned statements are simply confirming such.

In John 17:5 Jesus refers to that glory that was shared between them before His incarnation.

On the other hand Christ still holds the title God. If that were not so then why would Thomas make the statement "My Lord and my God", and why didn't Christ rebuke him if that were not the case?

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some are christians but i fear most are not. that's my personal view.

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@Lady

NA LIE. He is not God and claimed that God is greater than him.

John 14:

28 Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father[b]: for my Father is greater than I [/b]

29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

30 I and my Father are one

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How many of us venerate our wives/girlfriends/husbands/boyfriends.How many of you out there bow to their local chiefs or even prostrate to them or to money bags.Does anyone of us have the right to judge?.I think we should concentrate on doing good,loving one another.Churches and mosques are venues for the social gathering of the members-your denomination may not save you;think about it.

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@ chukwudi44

I am never one to bash Catholics since their teachings and actions have already done that. I am only revealing the obvious contradictions and erroneous teachings emanating from your friars, prelates, cardinals, and finally himself the pope.

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boobyaff is back, you re a bloody hypocrite name your church you wont yet you keep bashing the catholics as if u re any better

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Are Catholics Christians?   Well they think they are but they do a lot of things that God forbids.  ie Worship Graven images, not just of God but Mary.   The commit blasphemy every time they call a Priest Father because God said 'You shall call no man Father but me'

I am a borne again christian and I attend a Bible based Church.   It is really very simple.  All you need to do is believe in God and believe that he sent his only begotten Son to die on the cross for our sins.

Secondly, repent your sins and be baptised (as Jesus was baptised by John the baptist)

There is no need for any man made rituals such as saying the Rosary which is repetitive and God said not say prayers in a repetitive fashion.   There is no need to go to confession as a Priest cannot forgive your sins.  Go straight to God.   As for praying to Mary as a mediator God said 'The only mediator is the man Jesus'.

I feel very sorry that they do not realise all the things that they do which God forbids.

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Please I would like to make a little contribution to the 'debate'. I am writing this peacefully, je je-ly, and respectfully to all parties. I have found that argument and strife will always exists amongst doctrinal religionist for a very simple reason. No two human beings can think the same thing about the same topic/doctrine. To the extent that we are all individuals then our concepts and beliefs will reflect this individuality.

Hence as soon as christianity gets reduced to a doctrinal matter it becomes a cat and dog fight. What a lot of new age pentecostalists do not realise is that many of the points that they accept as being christian were argued over by the Catholic and Orthodox churches of the first millenium to the present day. The very divinity of Jesus christ was argued over for many decades before it was decided that yes indeed he was divine, and not only divine but one and the same as God, the father. Every time the church agreed on one doctrine it would then hound those that didn't believe it as heretics. Many times over the course of it's history various christians kept finding themselves being safe one minute and then excluded as heretics the next only to be reinstated as orthodox yet again. Being Christian is not an intellectual exercise, but rather it is living life with power and authority through grace.

I would highly recommend that everyone spends some time studying the history of the Church. Especially the first 500 years from the time of Paul to the time that Rome fell to the barbarians.

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Um Mother Theresa of Calcuta was a CATHOLIC NUN. Her missionary of charity is made up of catholic nuns.

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Ok so I came to this topic really late and I tried really hard to avoid it, but reading through, I just have a few things I observed and would like to comment on.

I really want to comment on the issue of "MARY MOTHER OF GOD"

The stance of the Protestants is that never was she called "MOTHER OF GOD" this is infact true.

But let's also keep in mind that never did Jesus call himself GOD. before u crucify me please finish reading

He was always the SON OF MAN. But he did say that he and the father are one. So from that we take it that he is also GOD.

It is in this same manner that Catholics say that Mary is the Mother of God. Elisabeth called her "MOTHER OF MY LORD" the "LORD" she's referring to is JESUS. If Jesus is LORD, and by faith he is God, that would make Mary the Mother of God. I understand the syllogism thing that someone points on earlier, but if u would disqualify the words spoken of Mary, then you must disqualify the words spoken of Jesus/by Jesus.

Um those who think they know about persecution of Christians should really do their research on it and come back and tell me which christians were persecuted. Last I checked the Catholics were persecuted by other christians or am I wrong?

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Yes Catholics Are Christians

please all christians should void themselves of every critics i repeat all christians should void themselves of all critics againts pastor, churches etc, becareful so your future will not experience a heavy burden by you speaking against spirited and hardworking pastors, reverends and churches beware

Pastor Prosper

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That disqualifies you to contribute here!

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If you guys are not catholics and don't understand what it is to be one, please just ask reasonable questions or just shut up. Don't condemn what you don't know about lest you commit sin out of ignorance caused by your silliness.

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@texazzpete

I GAT YOUR BACK BROTHER. I REALLY CANT IMAGINE HOW CERTAIN PEOPLE REASON

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OK, GANJA SEED@

another ignoramus in the house. abi, make una go find as una go improve una relationship with God almighty, Jesus Christ and the Holy spirit and with your fellow neighbors than to come here with una blind yarns about who be xtian and who no be. i wonder what good your doing yourself or somebody out there.abegi

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@Ganjaseed, Gamine

Kindly explain how the teachings of the Roman catholic Church are contrary to Christ's teachings.

gamine, please do well to show how catholics follow the pope and not jesus.

Funny how most people that claim they left the catholic church for pentecostal churches know little about the church they claim to leave from.

The cardinal issue is how people will beleive anything their pastors tell 'em. In my 100L in uni one deeper life came out accusing catholics of worshipping Nimrod.

in my 16 years (at that time) of being a catholic i had never heard of anyone called Nimrod. yet this guy walked away unconvinced.

Go figure

You really have to be the most silly person i've come across in 2008.

Afterall, if we all believe that all mexicans are greaseball illegal immigrants, drug smugglers and louts (based on portayal on TV) where does that leave you?

you, stranger, are an .

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What a silly argument !!!

Catholics are not Christians, they do not look like Christ nor behave like him.

Reflect your mind back to how Catholicism started, the blood they shed trying to hide the truth of free salvation from the whole world, Is that how Jesus behaved himself when he brought the truth and sacrifice himself and seal it with his blood ?

Any message or practise contrary to what Jesus stands for and taught is Anti Christ. The RCC fits this contrary description of an anti Christ.

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BIA MRS GIRL@ GAMINE

YOU WERE CATHOLIC, I NOW SEE WHY YOUR VIEW ARE JAUNDICED. IT DOSENT MATTER THOUGH THAT U WERE ONCE CATHOLIC AS I SEE YOU DON'T EVEN HAVE ANY FACT TO BACK UP YOUR ARGUMENT AND ITS OF NO ESSENCE RESPONDING TO YOUR BLIND ARGUMENT. I WONDER WHAT KIND OF CATHOLIC U WERE ANYWAY! LETS NOT UNDERMINE THE IMPORTANCE OF A SUBSTANTIAL AMOUNT OF RESEARCH BEFORE SCRIBBLING NOTHING OR BETTER STILL WE KEEP QUIET TILL WE COME UP WITH ENOUGH FACTS FOR OUR ARGUMENT.

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What we have are groups of christians going for each others throat.

The message of christ is smothered in the heat of argument and bickering.

We have many churches, but little virtue to show for it.

Non-christians will see us as unserious and will be reluctant to convert.

Christ knows the meaning and value of unity. That why he asked His Father for it

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Divisions?

What do you term a Division?

Any religion/sect/any name you could call it

that dosnt preach Jesus As Christ/Savior, the Spiritual Birth and as the only way to the Father is

not even christian to begin with.

It is false!

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Mr MAn

i was Catholic

And i am being objective!!!

If you follow Christ, you are Christian!

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@ GAMINE

ABEG, TRY DEY A LITTLE MORE OBJECTIVE IN YOUR ARGUMENT. WHAT D HECK DO YOU KNOW ABOUT US(CATHOLICS) SCRIBBLING ALL THAT.

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QUESTION: ARE CATHOLICS REALLY CHRISTIANS?

ANSWER: IF THIS WAS ACTUALLY ANOTHER HONEST QUESTION OUT OF IGNORANCE, THEN SURE WITHOUT GOING INTO ANY FUNDAMENTALS, THEY CERTAINLY FROM TIME IMMEMORIAL ARE CHRISTIANS. THEY BELIEVE IN CHRIST AS THE ONLY WAY TO GOD THE FATHER AND ETERNAL LIFE. PLEASE LETS ENDEAVOR TO MAKE A LITTLE RESEARCH BEFORE STARTING SUCH TOPIC. I FIND THEM RATHER UNBECOMING. EVER HEARD OF THE APOSTLES CREED(PRAYER OF SALVATION)

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Even Jesus was not called a christians.

Matthew 2: 23 "23: And he came and dwelt in a city called Nazareth: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophets, He shall be called a Nazarene."

It is the disciples of Paul the liar that were called Christians.

Acts 11: 26 "And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch."

Actually you will not find the word christian in the old testament. And it is used only three times in the new testament by Paul the liar.

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Mexico. . . hmmm.

Back here in Nigeria we have pentecostal pastors who burn church members with petrol, who sleep with their female members at random, who perpetuate all kinds of fraud, who consult occultic shrine to get charms to boost their church memberships etc.

Once upon a time it was a rave for protestant pastors in Nigeria to preach messages like:

"I used to be second in command to the devil before I got born again". I must have heard close to a hundred different pastors preach that message. How many second in commands did the devil have to pick from Nigeria, especialy since they keep stabbing him in the back (abi na Nigeria evil pass?).

No offense to pentecostals or fellow Nigerians.

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Yes christianity evolved from catholics but HECK NO they are not alike read our bible and read theres take a close look do some research there are so many differnces espically between mexicans I noe cuz I am a mexican christain and all my friends are catholics mexicans their parents get drunk party lyk there iz no 2morro and do so many thigns that are bible is against Imean come on no offense to catholics really or mexicans.

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The teachings of the Catholic Church are based on well articulated documents, not mere verbal arguments that can be misunderstood or mis-heard. Please see http://www.vatican.va/archive/catechism/ccc_toc.htm for the DOCUMENTED Cathechism of the Catholic Church. This document should be thoroughly read and digested (and meditated upon) by anyone who may be interested. Verbal arguments only serve to heat up the ambience.

On Catholic Spirituality, one of the finest volumes I have seen is titled "The Three Ages of the Interior Life" . An online copy can be found here : http://www.christianperfection.info . Captivating, meditative reading.

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Wen I come across issues like this, I am very careful to react, The truth is that whoeva has left the Catholic Church, left in ignorance or for "now-now" miracle. I know that God is a 4giving God even wen u want to prevail against His Church-The catholic Church. Pls my advise for all protestants is to seek the truth about the Catholic Church from the true spirit of God, for no man will satisfy you, Remember Saul was once like u, Still need clarification meet any Rev Fr or call me on 08038823212

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Thank God. The protestants are slowly learning the value and meaning of unity. They started the World Council of Churches (WCC) several years ago. Please see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Council_of_Churches , a nice article on the WCC.

You cannot base any lasting church or ecclesial community (or even a spirituality) by simply NEGATING all the teaching of the Catholic Church. You will simply end up with a group of dissenting members continually negating what was first negated. History is full of examples.

You might want to look at the story of Scott Hahn (http://www.scotthahn.com/) . He was a presbyterian pastor who converted to catholicism. Deeply intellectual, his publications marvel some of us traditional catholics, That is the spirit!

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The Catholicism has never contributed anything positive to the Christendom. They are hypocrite ! they could not destroy the truth when they where persecuting the early Christians destroying the bible so as to establish the kingdom of the Antichrist, so they came inn with their deception and corrupt the mind of many with heresies and occult ordnances. This is a grievous contribution to the Christian faith. But thank God for the Holy spirit. The holy spirit of God couldn't have thought the Roman Catholics to make images and bow down to them or place Mary and so call saints on higher priority that the Messiah, these are evil distrations of the Antichrist.

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"There are over 33,000 [protestant] denominations in 238 countries  and every year there is a net increase of around 270 to 300 denominations" (see  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protestant#Denominations)

If Martin Luther alone was entrusted with spreading the Gospel, the message of Christ would have died 1,000 years ago; because each family would have become a church unto itself. Every community/church will be in disagreement with every other community/church. The truth of Christ will be smothered in the heat of arguments and bickering.  Non-christians will percieve christians as a quarrelsome group in which each person seeks supremacy for his/her own benefit.

Jesus Our Lord knows human nature too well.  Thank Him for telling Peter (Matthew 16:18): "You are Peter, and on this rock I will build my Church". He foresaw our confusion and settled it long in advance,

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what a collosal error by ignorant people who claim to have once read the bible.

How naive can these people be? There are ancient new testament scrolls written in hebrew, greek and aramaic. Surely the catholics invented hebrew and aramaic too.

you are right because no were in the bible do we find a trace of the word "trinity". It is the invention of those who are easily led astray by heresies.

Even if we started going to church every wednesday God will not be angry and will still accept our worship. Sunday is just a convenient day and a tradition. The bible tells us to worship God in Spirit and in truth wherever we are whatever the date.

It is not the dates nor the celebrations perse, it is the remembrance of it that is most important. Every waking day in the life of a christian is a celebration of Christ's birth, death and resurrection. We dont have to wait for 2 days out of 365 to celebrate it.

Did you ignorant sheeple know that the breaking of bread is actually a celebration of Christ's death and resurrection and is celebrated whenever?

It is in the bible, the catholics did not invent that.

Their is no bible to construct. The letters of the bible were penned down long before catholicism appeared.

We will still have our Christ, our bible, our faith and our eternal hope of salvation.

o thou fool and slow to learn . . . Jesus Christ existed well before catholicism. The Jews recognise the existence of Jesus Christ yet they are not catholics.

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Don't mind the yeye sheeples.Let them remove all the contributions made by catholicism to christianity,and let us see what they will have left.

Let them start by turning their back on the NT to start with.Afterall,that fantastic fable was concucted by the catholic eccelesiasts.

Let them do away with the holy trinity,bacause that was another catholic invention.

Let them stop going to church every sunday.

Let them stop celebrating xmas and easter.

Let them stop believing that jesus is the only true son of god,or god made flesh(as they love to believe)

Let them throw away the entire "catholic" bible and construct their own

Let all the "real" christians do all that,and we will se what they will have left with to go on.

Catholicism is chrisitanity,fools.Without the catholic church,jesus christ would never have existed as you know him today.

Without catholicism,christianity would never have been anything but a collection of tiny sects with 1000s of different doctrines.

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if una like, deny from now till u die. .

Catholicism started christianity. catholic leaders of that time are responsible for the Bible you read today (and the books that were taken out of it too).

Other christian denominations broke away from them. (and broke away from those that broke away from cathlics).

So, I guess you are the real christians, they are just catholics, abi? ?

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@ganjaseed. feel you man, you spoke my mind in black and white

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After good ganja I settled down to view the behaviour of mankind especially those that goes to the Catholic shrine they called church, I discovered that everything they do is absolutely contrary and opposite to the Bible I know. Such people should not be called Christ-like (Christians) I think if they are rather called ( Marianist) I will be more comfortable with that. Jah Bless !

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We Catholics have stated our position time and time again and those who choose to accept do so and those who do not criticise. We need to remember that every thing about Christianity is based on the faith and faith is not based on other peoples interpretations of your actions.

The man who eats meat offered to idols and belives it tarnishes him not remains untarnished by it. If another man eats meat the same meat when he belife's otherwise then to him it is sin.

When you read most of the anti-catholic post, you find poeple making sweeping assumptions about the Catholic Church that leaves you wondering at the level of their ignorance about Catholics. The adherants of the faith are not ignorant of the bible and are not too silly to interprete it so when a Catholic, having read the bible and understood its content still afirms his faith then the least the non-catholic can do is leave him be.

Pentecostals hide under the garment of "Pentecostal" to try to act as-if-na-dem-holy-pass. But the blatant disregard for Christian tenents that emenate from that fold more than speaks for it's self. No body can say the Pentecostal Fellowship is pure. It stinks to the depth of hell and it is riddled with all kinds of occultic practices, whoremongering, avarice, money-grabbing-doctrines, power-drunk elders, charlatants, thieves, anti-christ etc. If any one claims otherwise, then the person is either a liar or simply ignorant. Even the bible says so (about the Christian fold). All of Christianity has been under assault right from the days of the appostles. Nothing is going on now that did not happen then. Christ fore-told it all.

So rather than sit back like arm-chair-arch-angels to condemn and critisise the Catholics, every man should take heed and stand firm, with faith and holiness, and gaurd against falling. When you begin to point at your brothers and sisters and condem them (like you are in possesion of the book of life and know who's name is written there) then look back at yourself and you will how much you have fallen from your last marker.

I read a book by CS Lewis over a decade ago - "A Toast to ScrewTape" (or is it ScrewTape Letters). He tried to capture in his writting, a conference of demons strategising how to bring down the Church; Realising that the age old methods of leading them into blatant sin doesn't work as it should since they where "too aware", the devised a more subtle and more potent method - stir up controversy among them. Let them attack themselves and bring down the roof of their divide house on their head. That seems to be the on going trend.

When that day comes, I firmly belive Christ wont say "All Catholics to the left , pentecostals to the right and others gather behind". It will be personal judgment for every individual.

While we wait for that day maybe the best policy is to continue flaming each other until there is nothing left but a well done crips. Let the Jackals feast on the remains.

Christians should unite in Christ or stand alone in Christ. Be in Christ Sha.

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The Roma Catholics church is indeed a church, but they worship the devil himself. From all their worship systems you can see that they are trying to prove God a lier by:-

1. God said do not make any image of any likeness of anything wether in heaven, earth, sea and beneath the earth.

* But the Roman Catholics are not adhering to this. They have more than enough images in their cult houses they

called churches.

2. Do not bow down to any graven image and worship it.

* But the Roman Catholics bow down and worship images.

3. Jesus is the only mediator between Man and God.

* But the Roman Catholics have also disapproved this by employing Mary to advocate for them.

What do we say about this ? This look more of anti Christ to me than Christianity.

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