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Olabowale Buys Christianity From Noetic: Can Olabowale Sell Islam?

subject to our primordial discussion of the other thread. . . . u asked "what is christianity"

my answer: christianity is a word deduced from the word christian.

The term christians was used by non-christians like u in acts 11 to describe the light as seen in the life of the believers of the goodnews Jesus came to teach.

ur next question. . . . . . .

u ask two questions, then my turn.

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It all bugs down to the premise. . . their position might be a reflection of their biblical knowledge or an ulterior motive.

The former is cool. . the latter is not Christ-like.

I dont think that there is a difference between the two. fearing God goes beyond literal fear.

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some versions call them "God-fearers". . . who do u think they were?

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Aight. But do u think those that don't take it literally are not true christians?

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my position on matters like this is to follow literal biblical explanations except for instances where symbols are used in the prophecy. . .then one needs the appropriate knowledge to know the meaning of the symbols before interpreting the prophecy.

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SO they are the early Christians, Paul's original converts etc ?

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Some believe it is symbolic. e.g. That it means that good will ultimately triumph over evil, no matter how powerful the evil may appear to be; and not an actual future event that will involve creatures as described in the bible.

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whats their basis for not believing the above?

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aight. thanks.

Christians that do not believe it is literally true that trumpets will blow, and some celestial battle with angels, beasts, etc will happen, are not real Christians?

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1. The church refers to the body of Christ. . . , body or believers and NOT a sect or denomination. catholic, RCCG et all are denominations.

2. The body of Christ does not dispute the authenticity of the bible. No true christians have a problem with the bible. true believers are only identified by the manifestation of the holy spirit. . .that was the same spirit that inspired the bible.

3. The God-worshippers, if I understand ur point. . .are those who worship the father (in acknowledgement of the son) in spirit and in truth.

4. the vote or other forms of bible are best understood by analysing the premise for having a different bible. what stops u from conducting ur own research and come up with ur findings?

5. The bible occured as it was written to form a picture of events to the church within the space of time. . . . .it was not written to be a guide to historians.

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There have always been disagreement over which Gospels had authority. . .right from the start. Which is why people had to vote on the canon. Even after the vote there were grievances.

Which church do u refer to as having no qualms with the Bible ? The Catholic church, coptic, gnostic etc, or the ones that came about about 1200 years later because of their different understanding of the Bible? Which one(s), in your opinion, have the right interpretation, and why?

Were Nigerians part of the target audience?

In your opinion, who were the target audiences and what message did the authors seek to convey to them?

U said the events in the new testament occured just as recorded, and then go on to say it is not a historical document, i'm not sure what u mean.

Who are the "God-worshippers" mentioned in the new-testament?

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I did not expect u to gasp the concept of trinity. . .its too complex for u. , .I understand.

Whats ur next question?

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@Noetic; « #36 on: Today at 11:54:45 AM »

[Quote]please open a thread and let me ask u questions about islam.[/quote]Its done, already. Ask sensible question even though you may have a headache trying to do it!

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I cant make a meaning out of the above.

please open a thread and let me ask u questions about islam.

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@Noetic2: « #33 on: Today at 10:43:51 AM »

This simpy means that the two remaining are independent and separate from the dead son, and their Godliness, individually or collectively, were not compromised. That shows to me that they are not 1 and the son was irrelevant to how the creations were ran! This is the constrictor you need to get off yourself before I address the salvation issue.

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I believe that ur concerns with regards to ELOHIM have been answered.

whats stopping u from opening a new thread to sell islam to me?

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@Noetic. . .did jesus refer to himself as "christ", or was that a title used to refer to him, by SOME of his followers, after his death?

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To have three Elohims is a terrible thing.

There is no way you will be able to sell this even in the moon, since there will be three Gods, Lords, Creators!

If you argued that you are making a mistake about 2 of them, I will give it to you that Shaitan has robbed his hand on you. Its a Quranic expression and e very keferi is under that shaitan's hand rob of them or over them.

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noetic should know that there is no way Elohim could be the name Father God.

same Elohim is also the name of son God.

and same name is also the name of ghost God.

What you have are three Elohims!

We will get to Muslim God soon, InshaAllah.

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And noetic2 is angry that Elohim is a wholesale name for gods or Gods in a particular semitic language. He was not ashamed that he used the same wholesale methology to cheapen what it means by the muslims when they say Allah!

What is shameless about his conscience is that he forgot that Moses spoke Egyptian coptic language and what the medians spoke since thats where he ran to, and the children of Israel in coptic bondage could not have had a language of their own different from what the slave masters used, otherwise they would have used that private language to undermine the masters, the exact same thing that the whites feared about africans who finally lost their languages and cultures and worse their names!

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Eloha= god

Elohim=gods

Is the concept of trinity=gods?

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Let me drive you up the wall for a short time more. when you are beat up badly, that i know i have you where i want you, then i will nail you to the wall with Islam, crushing you with the hammerhead blow.

By the way, was John a Christian, too, even he was not called so, or what about Moses, or Abraham, Noah and others, like Lot, Isaac, Jacob and Joseph to name a few, even thought I am forced to remember Elijah, Elisha, and Lot and Haron or do they have a nonchrist-like "way(s)?"

Your ignorance smelled to the heavens if you think all of the laws of adultary, thieft, idolatry, when God told Moses, you shall not have another God with Me, is all become Love? Then you can do any of those idolatry, having 3 gods, 2  or for or wathatever, and everything else and still fulfil the laws, even though everyone sees that your shock every last one of them, big or small? Why did Jesus warn against ablishing it then? And its presence in the Bible of the Christians, as OT, is for what purpose, when its now all Love?

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This is officially called ILLITERACY and IGNORANCE.

from ur own post, it is obvious that there are several definitions of the term ELOHIM. . . .as used by different speakers.

All u have done is to pick out one this terms. . . . .how EXACTLY does this definition of urs dispute/discredit the trinity definition?

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Elohim refers to the entire pantheon of the Canaanite gods and is used as to refer to god and gods by the ancient jews. What do you mean that Elohim is the trinity? Go tell that to a Jew if he doesn't slap your mouth for blasphemy.

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absolutely irrelevant. Its called a triune God.

this is pure semantics and subseuently irrelevant.

have u run out of questions? this is disgraceful.

why not open a thread to sell me islam if u can. . . . .

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@Noetic2: « #17 on: Today at 07:16:29 PM »  

Please explain.

And since you asked me the question, who was the speaker talking to since he used we, I will give you my own explanation.

Olayiwola is probably in your age group. If I were to talk to him to let him know about my royal blood or my fatherliness over him, I may say in yoruba about myself "awani baba e, or awa ni oko iya e ki won to bie", and the english translation of of them are "We are your father "or" we used to be your mother's husband before you were born." This is Olabs (your nickname for me) who was talkingabout himself, ddescribing himself only to his almost himself a father son!" If We can use this majestic pronoun(s) I am sure you dont expect less less of The One True God, unless you have bunches of demigods!

Since the Speaker did not ask permission from anyone, I am sure that He was capable of handling the Issue all alone. In my understranding, the text of the conversation was not as you said it is. It is "I am going to create a viceroy for the earth." The angels heard their Creator, their Lord God, Who was always and is always complete.  The word was what they heard. Word means Voice. Angels, from anong them is Gabreil. You do know about gabreil, the one you know told some woman that she will have a child? No?

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just look at ur own post:

from the above we can deduce two things.

1. Elohim is used to denote a single God.

2. Elohim is a plural word. . .referring to more than one.

That should tell anyone that the TRINITY is ONE but has three entities that form one. why is this so hard for u to gasp?

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you are so ignorant.

The old testament specifically, genesis talks about ELOHIM. . . . . .

Elohim is simply the trinity. . . .God the father, Son and Holy spirit.

have u ever heard the phrase Let us make man in our own image? who was who talking to?

1. why dont u open a thread and sell islam to me.

2. when u talk about "evidence" what EXACTLY are u refering to? I just want us to be on the same page here.

your religious orientation and world view is making it impossible for u to gasp/imagine other people living their lives without the boredom of meaningless religion.

Adam was not religious, was not called to form or practise a religion. His mandate was to have dominion over all that God has created.

Abraham was not called to form a religion. . .he was called to inherit a promise/covenant.

Moses bore the laws through which the israel nation is to be governed. . .he formed no religion.

Jesus had or formed no religion, . . . . .why is this too hard for u to gasp?

John the baptist called all men to repentance and baptism. . . . .did he also form a religion?

in the history of humanity only few people have formed religions. . . i know two of them. . . . mohammed and budha, demonic agents.

1. the verses i quoted are john 1:12 and john 4:23-24

2. I believe that the trinity question has been answered. what does ELOHIM mean?

I cant make a meaning out of the above. . .but let me state the following

1. the consequences for disobeying the law is physical/spiritual death. . . . .go read the old testament.

the law gives no room for restitution . . . . because the sacrifices offered became inadequate.

2 the reward for obeying the law is human prosperity and longevity. . . .go and read the OT

3. The coming of Jesus meant that man did not have to die spiritually even if he fails. . . . .there is redemption and salvation in Jesus.

it also implies that condemnation comes only by rejecting the Son (Jesus) as ur Lord and saviour.

4. while the punishment of the law is insignificant. . .fulfilling the law remains mandatory, which is what Jesus was emphasizing. He subsequently summarised the entire law into one. . . LOVE.

5. what do u understand by the kingdom of heaven?

Too many, but that will come later because while saying am come to fulfil and no jot will be abrogated, and warned any to never go against his statement, I immediately see, according to you that all of the laws and prophets are just a footnote type' Love God with all your heart and love your neighbor as yourself", seems to be so shallow and empty that one will be forced to ask among many; what is this love and how does it keep it possible that the Punishment for stealing as in death by hanging (the two who died when Jesus was hung wee thieves), and the adultary thing not stoning to death, since it was Jesus that saved the hyde of the propstitutes who could be accuused for fornication, and they went to Muhammad (AS) for adultary case in madina? You can start to explain from there.

later we will address the slave servant thing that Jesus was quoted to have call wealthy and poor christians alike. We will also talk about ther Trinity and then we will go to sects in Christianity which at least one in Ethipia still bow, prostrate as if they are Muslims! I will asllso show you the Jews who do exactly the same thing and you will have to expalin why you now clap, sing and dance as if its night club with a live band on the organ and drumset, etc!

[quote][/quote]

maybe we should start by defining LOVE? what is LOVE?

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Let the nonMuslims excite themselves about some nostagic videos. The issue as Noetic said, it depends on what you are talking about.

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« #10 on: Today at 05:19:07 PM »  

Your responses are wishy washy but i will let it slide because others will read it and know whats up.

later we will address the slave servant thing that Jesus was quoted to have call wealthy and poor christians alike. We will also talk about ther Trinity and then we will go to sects in Christianity which at least one in Ethipia still bow, prostrate as if they are Muslims! I will asllso show you the Jews who do exactly the same thing and you will have to expalin why you now clap, sing and dance as if its night club with a live band on the organ and drumset, etc!

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Islam means violence and death simple. . .

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2515587181120245843#

The link shows what Islam is all about. . . .Islam means violence, death and destruction of the infidels. . . . .

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1. depends on ur definition of God. If u refer to Jehovah God . . . .the God of the biblical prophets and the patriachs. . . . then YES it is a relationship with God.

john 1:12 says that for as many believed in Jesus, He gave them the power to become the sons of God, . . .to fellowship with God.

but if u are refering to Allah who mohammed and his father served. . . . .then u are talking of something else. christians have no business with arabian idols.

2. Judaism was never mentioned in the bible, torah or by moses himself. judaism is a coined word to describe an old-testamental practise.

3. you have just revealed that u have no idea as to what a christian means. Jesus was NEVER a christian. Jesus is CHRIST.

for as many as those who believed in Him. . . .and worship the Father in spirit and in truth . . .have been called to fellowship to be co-heirs of the kingdom.

it is unbelievers like u that call the saints . . .christians.

4. do u know the punishment for not obeying the law? if u do then u can appreciate why Jesus had to fulfill the law on our behalf?

5. what parts of the gospel do u find impossible to gasp?

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From what Noetic2 says Christianity is not a religion, but a relationship. But my question was to see if if the name or relationship is from God, devine in nature, unless Judaism, which Jesus practiced, prayed in, preached on, read its book of laws and prophets, is no more a relationship with God, since Jesus arived, if I assume that Jesus was the first christian, unless he was not a christian, so you have to explain why he spent all his life in an old rejected way, and you who takes him to be your god takes up a new way, different from what he took?

So many questions, but all are tied together bease on your strange statement to somebody like me who is trying to learn about your religion!

So that you know that I realised that banom asked question and you quoted John, it seems to me that only 4 disciples took time to pen something down, from among the 12, and are all the 4 Gospels completely correct with one another, without a verse missing from any. Please explain if you can but leave it alone if its going to cause a diversion. I will get to it in later date, you count on it!

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where is olabs and his tails? . . . where have they run to?

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a relationsship with God. . . , its a call to fellowship and worship in spirit and in truth. john 4:23-24

23Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks. 24God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in spirit and in truth."

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If it ain't a religion, then what is it ?

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from my initial definition of Christianity, it is obvious that it is phrase coined by unbelievers like u to describe believers who fellowship with God in the spirit.

so christianity aint a religion.

next question?

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And if you want us to go to Islam right away, we can. I will delay my Christian pricing/examination till later. My position right now is that I come to you with clean mind of no malice towards "Christianity", and am just asking questions, just as basic as possible. And people lets Noetic and me deal without too many interjections, leading to free for all. Thanks.

I want to learn Christianity from him, and in the process ask questions on issues about the "how it comes about" to what it is now, finding out who is the founder, and if the founder will recognise it, today, and what denomination or specific place of and type of worship and worshipper, respectively that will he/she say you are exactly like I left this religion!

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Is Christianity a devine religion from God (by name) through a named prophet, please give proof of it from the mouth of either.

And you do not set the rule; I set the rule. Otherwise, your two question and my two question will dilute the sense of direction of our discuss. When we are finish with Christianity, we will come to Islam. God willing both of us will still be alive. I still have close to 75 years nore on earth, God willing, so that I can deal with your type of minds. I will delay my time for paradise so that I can bring many more souls with me, InshaAllah.

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http://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-318783.0.html

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Please provide link for "the other thread".

That helps everybody else who may not know what you're talking about.

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I wish the other types of keferis can just hold back their skinning knives until noetics is truly defeated and then they can skin ihim as they want!

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